Hillsborough

grim_tales · Post by **grim_tales** » 17 Apr 2009, 15:59

I caught some of the Hillsborough tributes on TV over the last few days and they've been very moving

I was probably only about 6 when it happened so I don't remember hearing it then.. it's really sad to think those 96 people were just fans and their families who went to see a game and never came home

RIP

romerojpg · Post by **romerojpg** » 17 Apr 2009, 16:06

I watched it happen live on the TV, rather shitty stuff it has to be said.

grim_tales · Post by **grim_tales** » 17 Apr 2009, 16:07

Really? Must have been awful

romerojpg · Post by **romerojpg** » 17 Apr 2009, 16:12

I was young at 11, but I do remember it well as I was alone in the house and it was pretty bloody disturbing watching that happen in front of you on TV. I never even watched Football as a young un, probibly just finished watching something or was waiting for the show after it and that started happeing.

Not very nice thing to see on Tv at a young age, well even for adults.

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 17 Apr 2009, 16:37

I remember it also. Though not vividly. I would've been 9 or 10. I can't remember how I felt or the impact it made to be honest.

romerojpg · Post by **romerojpg** » 17 Apr 2009, 16:52

It was just like 9/11 really, a massive telivised disaster that had never happened before. Its one of thoese things you just watch in awe and shock.

saltysam · Post by **saltysam** » 17 Apr 2009, 20:30

I remember it vividly and know people who were there. i was 25 at the time.truly shocking and the goverment/police cover up was/is a travesty of justice.that twat Duckinfield lied about the gates being forced open,tried to shift the blame onto the fans and has never faced a charge.

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 18 Apr 2009, 15:42

The Police made a terrible mistake... but it seems that Liverpool fans refuse to accept any responsibilty at all for what happened.

Thankfully lessons were learned and all-seater stadia became mandatory.

saltysam · Post by **saltysam** » 18 Apr 2009, 22:07

Markgway wrote: but it seems that Liverpool fans refuse to accept any responsibilty at all for what happened.

why should they?

Markgway wrote:Thankfully lessons were learned and all-seater stadia became mandatory.

On paper..go on to the Kop at Anfield for a big european game for example and it's standing all the way.i don't agree with it but it's what happens.

grim_tales · Post by **grim_tales** » 18 Apr 2009, 23:20

It's very sad that 96 people have to die for laws to change and stadiums to be made safer

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 19 Apr 2009, 01:13

saltysam wrote:
Markgway wrote: but it seems that Liverpool fans refuse to accept any responsibilty at all for what happened.
why should they?

The Police fucked-up big time no doubt. But these things are never black and white. Terrible mistakes were made; some of them because of the fans. But there doesn't seem to be any recognition or acceptance of that. Would it have happened had fans without tickets not turned up in droves? If impatient fans had not created pressure outside the ground would the gates have been opened? Admitting some portion of blame wouldn't make the disaster any less tragic. But the accepted wisdom blames The Police (primarily), the referee, the club, the FA... anyone BUT the fans. And we all know how difficult football fans can be (not least with some under the influence of alcohol). Of course so many innocents were caught up in the trouble and no one deserved what happened. I can't state that clearly enough lest anyone think I'm being harsh or unsympathetic. But if you read the evidence the Liverpool fans undoubtedly played their part. They should dispense with the victim mentality and accept that what happened was a horrible catalogue of mistakes and bad judgement not least (some) of their own.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hillsborough_disaster

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 19 Apr 2009, 01:18

grim_tales wrote:It's very sad that 96 people have to die for laws to change and stadiums to be made safer

Yes it is. But sometimes bad things have to happen before anyone pays attention. The sad irony is that the fences were built to stop fans from pitch invasions (and England's reputation for hooliganism didn't help matters). But obviously no one considered the health and safety risks involved. All-seater stadia has now ensured that such a tragedy cannot happen again (on those terms) and anyhow I'm sure we all would've preferred yet another pitch invasion on that day to the massive loss of life that ultimately occured.

saltysam · Post by **saltysam** » 19 Apr 2009, 14:24

"The police chose to put the Nottingham Forest fans in the Spion Kop End of the ground, which had a capacity of 21,000. The Liverpool supporters were assigned to the Leppings Lane End of the stadium, which could only hold 14,600 fans, even though Liverpool were regarded as having a larger support than Nottingham Forest."...Which muppet decided to give the club with one of the largest support in the world the smaller end

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 19 Apr 2009, 20:37

Yes, that was a ridiculous mistake. Just one of many.