Terminator 2: German Special Edition HD-DVD!

saltysam · Post by **saltysam** » 02 Mar 2008, 20:23

is the company releasing this hd-dvd exclusive? if not surely they'll release it on BD as well?

saltysam · Post by **saltysam** » 16 Mar 2008, 18:00

from avs

"First reviews of the T2 Ultimate HD DVD in Germany are saying that the PQ is more or less equal with the exisitng Studio Canal version."

(babelfished)

Picture. 68 %
The transfer of the HD-DVD is very clean and calm up to extremely rarely arising scratches. Times more, times less, shows Terminator 2 "an uneven noise in the picture". The contrast is not perfect, because the picture over-radiates in parts also easily. Altogether the picture works however quite plastic and compared with many current productions excessively also not artificially verfremdet. The colors appear very naturally and individual colours as in particular blue and red work very intensively.

Who expected now from the HD-DVD also in relation to an immense jump in quality the DVD, something will be probably disappointed. Because while current productions offer frequently a crack-sharp picture, the HD-DVD point the borders out of the masters, who already reached not completely on the DVD the optimum despite more sharpness. The image definition is not excessively strong for HDTV conditions. The picture works predominantly quite softly. Clear differences to the DVD are noticeable primarily in close-ups, which show detail to show frequently much much and also clearly that it concerns genuine HDTV here, in addition, Top level not completely to reach. Panorama attitudes or act ion sequences show more frequently remarkable Unschaerfen. Despite the somewhat soft detail representation the picture of the HD-DVD works however altogether quite plastic. The video compression works perfectly and shows no disturbances.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 16 Mar 2008, 21:06

Thanks Salty.

That info doesn't specifically say it looks the same as the Studio Canal transfer. I'll still likely pick it up for the overall all-round better package. Even if AV wise it's about the same as the cheap as chips UK HD-DVD.

Considering how expensive it is though I'm going to wait until I actually have a player on this one.

saltysam wrote:is the company releasing this hd-dvd exclusive? if not surely they'll release it on BD as well?

I imagine they will eventually but it won't be for several months and when more Profile 1.1 BDs start coming.

saltysam · Post by **saltysam** » 16 Mar 2008, 21:20

there's no way i'd be paying the premium price for this- my decent studio canal will comfortably do me until a good BD version appears.68% is not a good score,but it's only 1 review.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 16 Mar 2008, 21:24

True but as it's converted from another language it's hard for me to rely on completely. I'd like to be able to read it in proper English so I can understand exactly what they mean.

Do guys over at AVS actually have it to say it's about the same as the Studio Canal transfer?

gasteropod · Post by **gasteropod** » 16 Mar 2008, 22:43

EvaUnit02 wrote:I love how they've retained the bad American spelling of Judgement on the boxart though. It always gets a chuckle out of me when I pull out my R1 UE.

But that's the title of the film, it's an American film.

'Pearl Harbor' didn't have its spelling changed for the UK DVD either.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 16 Mar 2008, 22:47

It it is a particulary bad re-spelling though. I think that's what Eva meant.

EvaUnit02 · Post by **EvaUnit02** » 16 Mar 2008, 22:53

bradavon wrote:It it is a particulary bad re-spelling though. I think that's what Eva meant.

Exactly.

It's the opposite situation with the PS3 game, Eye of Judgement, the US version uses the "proper" spelling. The dumbasses at ie Wallmart, etc, have been known to have had difficulty finding the game in their systems due to the unfamiliar spelling.

gasteropod · Post by **gasteropod** » 16 Mar 2008, 23:18

What 're-spelling'? American English is a different language to English, hence different spellings.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 16 Mar 2008, 23:30

It's the same language, different dialect. Hence why I said re-spelling not misspelling

EvaUnit02 wrote:It's the opposite situation the PS3 game with Eye of Judgement, the US version uses the "proper" spelling. The dumbasses at ie Wallmart, etc, have been known to have had difficulty finding the game in their systems due to the unfamiliar spelling.

gasteropod · Post by **gasteropod** » 17 Mar 2008, 00:04

bradavon wrote:It's the same language, different dialect.

Ahh yes, I stand corrected on that.

saltysam · Post by **saltysam** » 22 Mar 2008, 22:33

Review of the german set here

http://www.dvdtown.com/reviews/terminat ... t-day/5746

EvaUnit02 · Post by **EvaUnit02** » 23 Mar 2008, 02:07

Thanks Salty. Hmmm, German HD doesn't seem worth it.

To begin, there are five separate viewing modes for watching the film.

They couldn't seamlessly branch the Theatrical Cut? Fucking lame.

If I can't find the Studio Canal HD for cheap, then I'll just wait for a Lionsgate BD remaster. Thank god that Terminator 4 is in the works, it'll prompt the double-dips. Hopefully Fox will give us a worthwhile T1 disc as well.

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 23 Mar 2008, 20:05

Yeah, with mono!!

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 25 Mar 2008, 02:25

As to a T1 BD:

Personally I'd be happy if Fox just reissued the exisiting BD but put it out on a BD50 and gave it a proper HD Remaster. It would be a bonus for me if it also had Mono but Losssless 5.1 is what ultimately want.

There is a good chance it will have Mono though. This is Fox which means DTS-HD MA and seeing as DTS isn't really compatible back to Stereo (i.e - Most HDTVs are Stereo) they'll likely include a second track alongside the DTS-HD MA.

They did this for Die Hard. It has the original Dolby Surround too. I presume DH is a Dolby Surround movie.

As to T2 HD-DVD:

As we suspected it's pretty clear the German HD-DVD also uses the same French Studio Canal Master.

I bet all they did was up the bitrate a wee bit to claim "they've remastered it". It's clearly a case of buying this for the extras and overall LE type package.

I'll likely buy it when I have my hands on the LG Combo but will wait until I do, just in case. Terminator 2 is an amazing film and easily the best action film ever made (even better in it's Extended Cut form) so I am happy to pay that bit extra for special package for it.

Plus a aside from it being HD-DVD and not BD it's got everything I want in a package and I wont' need to upgrade it any time soon.

EvaUnit02 · Post by **EvaUnit02** » 25 Mar 2008, 08:12

bradavon wrote:There is a good chance it will have Mono though. This is Fox which means DTS-HD MA and seeing as DTS isn't really compatible back to Stereo (i.e - Most HDTVs are Stereo) they'll likely include a second track alongside the DTS-HD MA.

Nah, DTS-HD supports any number of channels up to 8 channels, the short comings of Standard Def DTS codec no longer apply.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 25 Mar 2008, 19:41

DTS supports anything from 1.0 to 5.1 but I believe only when decoded from a DTS Decoder. You also forget if you cannot decode DTS-HD you'll get the DTS Core which is identical to DTS as used on DVD, ergo the same old rules apply.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Another T2 German HD-DVD Review:

http://hddvd.highdefdigest.com/681/terminator2_ge.html

On top of that, Kinowelt/Imagion present 'T2' on this HD DVD in the director's cut version (which utilizes material from both the theatrical cut and extended version masters) so this is truly a "hodgepodge" of a release.

Huh?

The result is that I slightly preferred the transfer of this 'Ultimate HD-Edition' to the domestic Blu-ray, with the major caveat that the differences are minor enough that few will notice without doing side-by-side comparisons. These differences are also a matter of subjective taste, so some may just as easily disagree with me and prefer the Lionsgate edition. In other words, don't expect any real upgrade with this 'Ultimate HD-Edition' -- it's pretty dang close to the Blu-ray you probably already have.

Interesting.

All other reviews say the HD-DVDs easily better. Maybe for those who prefer the Theatrical Cut should check out the USA BD after all. It only has DD5.1 (plus a broken DTS track) but for many that will do just fine. That even has two commentaries (both on this HD-DVD).

saltysam · Post by **saltysam** » 04 Apr 2008, 15:47

Movietyme have this at £24.99

http://www.movietyme.com/catalog/produc ... 3482d4e395

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 04 Apr 2008, 15:52

Great thanks Salty. I am so tempted to pick this up, but it is a lot to spend when I cannot play it and a BD may come in the mean time.

It's such an awesome film, I am happy to pay extra for a proper release. I believe £24.99 makes it a wee bit cheaper than at Amazon.de. One day I'll actually be able to use vouchers at MovieTyme. I don't know why they bother, they always expire in 7 days.

EDIT: €38.62/£30.47 Delivered to the UK from Amazon.de (€31.97 before postage) OR €34.99/£27.62 from a Amazon.de Market place seller.

Isn't not Limited right?

EvaUnit02 · Post by **EvaUnit02** » 04 Apr 2008, 15:54

bradavon wrote:
On top of that, Kinowelt/Imagion present 'T2' on this HD DVD in the director's cut version (which utilizes material from both the theatrical cut and extended version masters) so this is truly a "hodgepodge" of a release.
Huh?.

Read the rest of the paragraph that you quoted it from, the explanation is all there.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 04 Apr 2008, 16:03

I've worked out what he meant.

The Extended Cut (actually the Special Edition not Director's Cut) uses footage from the Theatrical Cut and Extended Extended Cut (only found complete on the R1). Which isn't surprising when the Extended Extended Cut is the Extended Cut (Special Edition) except for two extra scenes.

What is the Extended Extended Cut called on the R1 UE? I cannot remember. I know what most consider the Director's Cut is actually a Special Edition and the Theatrical Cut is actually the Director's Cut.

dvdvision · Post by **dvdvision** » 05 Apr 2008, 09:02

Here's the run down :

TC : transfered from the negative

DC : uses the TC + new transferts of the extra scenes seamlessly added

DCSE : this is the DC with the rejected ending plus one extra T-1000 scene also newly transfered and seamlessly added.

I don't see how this separate extra scenes being seamlessly branched would be a disappointement, it have always been that way (and the negative is the TC cut). Does the reviewers realise that all movies on DVDs are seamlessly branched, usually in 4 parts VOB files ?

EvaUnit02 · Post by **EvaUnit02** » 05 Apr 2008, 09:46

From the Feedback section of the review:-

Just saw this posted over at AVS:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...1#post13465375
Quote:
Versions on the disc:
There is only the Directors Cut on the HD DVD (so far!). The initial plan was to include both versions on the disc. This was not realized on the final product. But there is still a chance that the Theatrical Version will be activated via the dynamicHD online features in the future. This can not confirmed yet but the producer is checking the possibilities on this and depending on request they may add the elements and playlists for the Theatrical Version.

I would definitely buy the disc if it had the TC, as that's my preferred version. (Much better pacing. Added story details like Sarah's vision dream of Reese and more footage of Dyson's family are nice and all, but they really slow the film down.)

I'm not sure what to think about the possibilities of stuff like BD-Live TBH. If it means that they can "patch" faults in the authoring then I'd be all for that. BUT hopefully that road wouldn't lead to laxer Q.A., i.e. "We have to get this out before Xmas, don't worry if there's anything wrong since we can always patch it later."

EvaUnit02 · Post by **EvaUnit02** » 05 Apr 2008, 10:04

Lionsgate BD vs. Studio Canal HD.

LAME, the German disc only has a DTS-HD High Resolution track. I'll be getting the UK disc with the lossless Master track then.

From the comments section of the review:-

The German Release includes a 7.1 DTS-HD (High Definition, not MA) and the UK/French includes a 5.1 DTS-HD MA (High Definiiton Master Audio). From what I've read Kinowelt decided to use only DTS-HD, because using HD MA would have improved nothing (the Source wasn't good enough). If they included two HD MA Tracks they'd had to downsize the Video Stream, which I'm happy they didn't.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 05 Apr 2008, 11:58

dvdvision wrote:DCSE : this is the DC with the rejected ending plus one extra T-1000 scene also newly transfered and seamlessly added.

I wonder why that extra scene was never made part of the Special Edition? The correct names btw are:

Theatrical Cut/Director's Cut
Special Edition
Extended Special Edition

dvdvision wrote:I don't see how this separate extra scenes being seamlessly branched would be a disappointement, it have always been that way (and the negative is the TC cut).

I'd guess they simply choice not to include it, so they could re-release it later. They never released it using Seamless Branching outside of North America. The UK DVD SE was only the Special Edition and the French one was 3 discs.

dvdvision wrote:Does the reviewers realise that all movies on DVDs are seamlessly branched, usually in 4 parts VOB files ?

I'm sure they do but that's not what people mean when they say Seamless Branching.

This can not confirmed yet but the producer is checking the possibilities on this and depending on request they may add the elements and playlists for the Theatrical Version.

Thanks Eva. That is presuming it's Seamless!

Usually when this is done as an afterthought it's anything but seamless.

I'm not sure what to think about the possibilities of stuff like BD-Live TBH.

The German HD-DVD is Profile 1.1 not Profile 2.0 meaning I guess they can send the data down using it's web content. I am very dubious A: They'll ever do this or B: It would work too well.

LAME, the German disc only has a DTS-HD High Resolution track. I'll be getting the UK disc with the lossless Master track then.

Generally speaking I've read so many conflicting reports over HR and MA I'm never sure who to read any more. I've read reports the UK disc has DTS-HD HR. I'd be surprised if the German disc isn't MA too.

What review is this info from? It's not part of the High Def. Digit review. Although that does say it's DTS-HD HR too. The French HD-DVD has English DTS-HD MA and French DTS-HD HR, they should've done the same in Germany.