French Blog in memorial to the two youngsters...

thelostdragon · Post by **thelostdragon** » 09 Nov 2005, 14:57

I think it would be more unlikely to stop the riots with religion if their background really was religious. The fact that it is not a religious riot makes it easier to convince them to stop by knocking sense into their heads with religion.

Yi-Long · Post by **Yi-Long** » 09 Nov 2005, 15:07

Some dutch right-wing collumnists also again blaims Islam/Muslim for the violence, while not spending a single word on the police's reputation of treatment towards these innercity kids...
It's such a shame that whenever shit happens where 'arabic' peeps are involved, people stop looking for the real motives, and automatically just point the finger at the religion.
If that's true, I guess all those football hooliganisme in England and Italy etc, are because most of those people are christians/catholics?
Same BS

The sad part of this whole thing is, that the country will only become more divided, and you will actually have lots of people agreeing with cops being violent against these kinda youths...

These dumb kids should have just protested ina civil, normal manner, and people would start asking questions about what's really going on in the poor areas, and why these kids were so affraid of the cops, etc etc. Now, those questions won't be asked, and even if they are asked, no-one really gives a shit anymore cause they now feel all these youths are scumm, so they'd deserve the treatment given to them by the cops...

Mordib · Post by **Mordib** » 09 Nov 2005, 16:41

the dutch political model is my current obsession, i find it ultimately intriguing how a society with a reputation of being so open is now rapidly coming full circle in terms of right wingers getting power and swaying public opinion. will it all settle down or will this shift continue to increase at an alarming speed.

and you're right LD, i dintthink about it that way, the lack of religeon in the riots really does allow their religeous leader to alter their opinions, say 'thats wrong, thats not what its all about'... good stuff really

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 09 Nov 2005, 17:38

Yi-Long wrote:The sad part of this whole thing is, that the country will only become more divided, and you will actually have lots of people agreeing with cops being violent against these kinda youths...
These dumb kids should have just protested ina civil, normal manner, and people would start asking questions about what's really going on in the poor areas, and why these kids were so affraid of the cops, etc etc. Now, those questions won't be asked, and even if they are asked, no-one really gives a shit anymore cause they now feel all these youths are scumm, so they'd deserve the treatment given to them by the cops...

I agree with that. All these rioters have done is confirm the worst that was said/thought about them. A peaceful protest is always going to get people to listen more than violence and anarchy. Let's face it: there are a lot of people who get a kick out of causing social discord; for some it's religious motives, others not. The football hooligans comparison is very apt. These people are not victims - even if they once were - they're the oppressors. And as I always say: it's the decent people who suffer. Every damn time. I'd like to think that social responsibility, law and order, common decency had more of a part to play in the riots calming down than either religious interference or tiredness, but I fear not. 1200 cars a night is hard stamina to maintain.

I don't know what alcoholic beverage you're referring to, Mordib.

Yi-Long · Post by **Yi-Long** » 09 Nov 2005, 18:22

Mordib wrote:the dutch political model is my current obsession, i find it ultimately intriguing how a society with a reputation of being so open is now rapidly coming full circle in terms of right wingers getting power and swaying public opinion. will it all settle down or will this shift continue to increase at an alarming speed.

I've said it before and I'll say it again: Holland has never been 'tolerant', it's been greedy and lazy. Our goverment just has no morals...

Prostitution is only allowed, because that way the goverment is 'in' on it, cause the whores will have to pay taxes.
Same thing with soft-drugs: Illegal.... untill the goverment just demanded it would from now on handle production/distribution or whatever, and so it's just an extra source of income for the goverment.
You really think our goverment gives a shit about the prostitutes or about kids using drugs? No... they only care about they get their share!

The population HAS become less 'tolerant' though. To me, the phrase 'tolerant' is already wrong when you're talking about intergration. Tolerating is something that you don't like, but you live with it anyway...
What kind fo attitude is that? 'We don't really WANT you black people here... but we're cool peeps so we'll 'tolerate' you...'
That's just fucked up.
Instead of tolerating, we should be ACCEPTING these new people, and respecting them, and ofcourse, they should also show respect for our culture etc. But integration is a 2-way thing, and many Dutch people don't really realize that. They complain about maroccans only hanging out with maroccans, but they don't take any initiative to get to know 'foreigners' either...
But yeah, after the Fortuyn murder and the Van Gogh murder, and ofcourse (as ALWAYS throughout history) the current declining economy has something to do with it as well.

I always like it when people complain about foreigners doing nothing... and when foreigners DO do something, people complain about them stealing 'our' jobs. People laugh at turks in a big old stationwagon, but when a turk has a nice sportscar, they just assume he got it through criminal activities.
We all want all these maroccans and turks to stop importing brides... but when our white daughters talk about their new turkish/maroccan boyfriend, her white parents want her to get out of that relationship ASAP cause the guy will be no good to her...

-sigh-

We ain't 'tolerant', we are too lazy to solve the real problems so we either 'legalize' it, so we at least can get a share of the profits, or we just deny the problem altogether.

tom2681 · Post by **tom2681** » 10 Nov 2005, 09:59

299 Cars last night.
That's a 35% drop in one night.

Things are calming down.

grim_tales · Post by **grim_tales** » 10 Nov 2005, 11:05

Yi that is an excellent post about "tolerance"

thelostdragon · Post by **thelostdragon** » 10 Nov 2005, 11:10

I guess the French government benefits from the bombing attacks in Amman as the focus of the international media is now on Jordan.

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 10 Nov 2005, 18:02

No place is safe from these murderers.

And I agree with what Yi-Long said about welcoming immigrants as new compatriots rather than tolerating them as dirty foreigners. I think the problem Britain has with asylum seekers is two-fold: 1. fake asylum seekers slipping thru the net in their thousands at the expense of genuine refugees. 2. Britain is a tiny island and there's only so much room. When you add newcomers to areas that are already poor and with low employment rates it's asking for trouble.

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 19 Mar 2006, 19:15

Tom or anyone else what happened with this conflict?

It was all over the British news then nothing. I presume the conflicts stopped? If so when and how?

Did that politician apologise?

tom2681 · Post by **tom2681** » 19 Mar 2006, 19:23

It started roughly around the 27th of October and stopped on November 17th according to the police.
There's a total of 10 000 destroyed cars, 2000 wounded and 1 dead.

The riots just decreased in intensity over the days, there was no apology IIRC.

romerojpg · Post by **romerojpg** » 19 Mar 2006, 19:30

Were many people arrested at all? or did the police just not do that as they may spark off more riots?

bradavon · Post by **bradavon** » 19 Mar 2006, 19:30

Thanks. So it could easily happen again.

tom2681 · Post by **tom2681** » 19 Mar 2006, 19:41

Romero wrote:Were many people arrested at all?

A total of 3000 people were arrested. Most of them were freed after 48 hours.
I'm sure they kept a few of them in custody, but not nearly enough.

Brad wrote:So it could easily happen again.

Sure. Actually it's happening right now.

52 wounded, 167 people arrested today.
But it's a different kind of riot (not the same cause).

Cops are quick to use their batons today.

romerojpg · Post by **romerojpg** » 19 Mar 2006, 20:03

Is quickness to beat a good thing? I personally say yes most the time, but not when it could kick off another awful riot on the scale of the last one.

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 19 Mar 2006, 20:20

I'd love to be able to beat the shit out of people with a baton... but that's a different story. I'm sure most of them in France deserved it. Rioting scummers.

tom2681 · Post by **tom2681** » 21 Mar 2006, 00:17

Don't think I need to provide a translation.
Sometimes you gotta be able to sit back and enjoy the silliness of those riots.

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 21 Mar 2006, 00:39

Tom2681 wrote:Sometimes you gotta be able to sit back and enjoy the silliness of those riots.

Unless of course your car gets torched.......

tom2681 · Post by **tom2681** » 21 Mar 2006, 00:52

OK, ok, Mr Negative.

tom2681 · Post by **tom2681** » 27 Mar 2006, 23:46

Tomorrow's gonna be a big day over here.
Many people will go on strike and will join demonstrations in the street to protest against the CPE.

CPE is short for Contrat de Première Embauche (literally "First-time job"), a new kind of "youth employment law".
The CPE encourages hiring, but it also makes it easier to fire people.

Labor and Student groups have asked De Villepin (the prime minister) to withdraw the text and quit his post.

We'll just have to see how far it goes...cause it looks like another riot is about to start.