Why is it the English not British team?

[bradavon]

I suspect in Scotland and Wales the Scottish/Welsh flags are often displayed but the English flag is virtually never seen outside of sporting events with the British flag being displayed instead.

Why do we therefore not have a British football team for the world cup? Or any other sport for that matter.

It seems odd in this day and age of "Britain" that when it comes to sporting events it's still strictly "English, Welsh and Scottish".

I also find when I hear Scotts or Welsh say "I'll be supporting anyone except England". I can say with some assurance if Scotland were playing France at football the vast majority would be supporting Scotland, no question. I noticed exactly the same equivalent while in Australia.

[romerojpg]

Because Football is shit.

[grim_tales]

In some sports (eg tennis) - it is Great Britain not England, though I have noticed English flags at Wimbledon as well as British ones.
I noticed that thing too about the world cup Brad - about supporting England's opponents. OK people can support who they want but Andy Murray represents GB in tennis and relies mainly on an English Wimbledon crowd :x
If we had a GB team most of the squad would be England anyway I bet

[romerojpg]

I just hope England get knocked out very quickly and it shuts the nutter fans up, as people are loonies at this time screaming in the streets like mental lunatics and getting away with things they would normally get locked up for.

Sick of the "Sport" already but cannot wait to see the violence erupt as thats always fun saddos.

[romerojpg]

I will shut up now as its off topic off on one.

[bradavon]

While I completely agree Romero, three posts is enough bitching thank you. Please start your own thread if you wish to rant (I'll know doubt join you).

You're mistaken if you think England getting knocked out early will stop all the World Cup fever. It won't be over for about another 6 weeks. I hear England are one of the favourites to win, apparently we've got one of the strongest teams for years. Not that I care tbh.

In some sports (eg tennis) - it is Great Britain not England

I didn't know that, cheers. That makes even less sense why everything else isn't. There must be a reason.

I noticed that thing too about the world cup Brad - about supporting England's opponents.

In my experiance if you ask the average non-Brit what the British flag means they'll say English, which is of course completely wrong. A Scottsman will be called Scottish but an Englishman could be either English or British.

If we had a GB team most of the squad would be England anyway I bet

Of course but that's not the point

[Markgway]

I suspect in Scotland and Wales the Scottish/Welsh flags are often displayed but the English flag is virtually never seen outside of sporting events with the British flag being displayed instead.

This is because the British flag has become synomonous with England and whenever Britain is mentioned in football it's England that is meant and no one else. The English fans have taken the Union Jack as their own. This doesn't happen in other sports. Grim previously mentioned tennis in which all players play under the British banner therefore I have no problem supporting Tim Henman.

Why do we therefore not have a British football team for the world cup?

Let's face it a British team would be an English team. Once in a BLUE MOON would a Scots, Welsh or Northern Irish player get into the squad. At least with four teams we have a set-up which represents the four nations.

I also find when I hear Scotts or Welsh say "I'll be supporting anyone except England". I can say with some assurance if Scotland were playing France at football the vast majority would be supporting Scotland, no question.

I'm one of those I'm afraid... but for me it's only down to football. I'm not like that with other sports (unless Scotland themselves are playing). When it comes to football the English media get right up everyone else's noses. Do I care about Wayne Rooney's foot? Not in the slightest. Is it necessary to mention 1966 twice in the space of 30 secs (which actually happened during today's friendly with JAMAICA!) -- no it isn't! I take it as friendly rivalry rather than anti-English sentiment - but for some - too many - it IS the latter which is a shame.

I noticed exactly the same equivalent while in Australia.

How do you mean?

[bradavon]

This is because the British flag has become synomonous with England and whenever Britain is mentioned in football it's England that is meant and no one else.

I was hoping you'd comment for some proper reasons.

True but why? It's only become synonymous I'd guess because the Scottish and Welsh (Northern Ireland isn't technically part of Britain, look at your passport) never use it.

The English fans have taken the Union Jack as their own.

How so? Not once have I seen the British flag, it's the English flag everywhere.

This doesn't happen in other sports. Grim previously mentioned tennis in which all players play under the British banner therefore I have no problem supporting Tim Henman.

As we're all supposed to be British why not support the English players too?

Let's face it a British team would be an English team. Once in a BLUE MOON would a Scots, Welsh or Northern Irish player get into the squad.

That's only because I'm guessing it's not taken seriously in Scotland or Wales and therefore no decent players are produced. I can't believe there is no talent in said countries.

I'm one of those I'm afraid... but for me it's only down to football. I'm not like that with other sports (unless Scotland themselves are playing).

Why? It seems a bit pathetic to me.

When it comes to football the English media get right up everyone else's noses.

Well true, it's just as annoying here but why? At least in Northern Ireland's case they have relatively recent reasons to dislike the English. Wales and Scotland haven't been at war with England for centuries.

I'm willing to be if Scotland won the world cup or beat England at a football match (for example) it would be mentioned every time they played football ever again.

no it isn't! I take it as friendly rivalry rather than anti-English sentiment - but for some - too many - it IS the latter which is a shame.

Like I just said I don't understand why? Of course it's historical but it just seems pathetic to me to even have any opinion when we're talking about events from centuries ago.

I noticed exactly the same equivalent while in Australia.

How do you mean?

I'm glad you asked. While in Australia I noticed so many Australians saying "we love it when we beat the English". Fair enough it's nice to beat another country but it was the "particularly English" part which annoyed me and didn't understand.

Particularly if you ask the average Englishman his opinion of Australia and he will give you a glowing report of the people and country. In sports an Englishman would happily cheer on the Aussies too.

Again it's historical but again we're talking about events that happened centuries ago and in the case of Australia it's even more stupid when you consider the Australian nation is only about 50 years old anyway. It was Brits (not just English) who went over to Australia in the first place.

[Markgway]

True but why? It's only become synonymous I'd guess because the Scottish and Welsh (Northern Ireland isn't technically part of Britain, look at your passport) never use it.

The English sometimes seem uncomfortable with asserting their Englishness (compared to the Celtic nations) and so maybe that's why they use the Union Jack as well as the St. George Cross so as not to offend anyone? I've no problem with England fans flying the St. George Cross. I'm no expert... just my guesses.

As we're all supposed to be British why not support the English players too?

In football? Well England isn't Scotland. In football we're seperate countries; in tennis we're not. It's partly jealousy on our part for being so shite at our national sport. But also because England acts as though it's national team is better than it actually is. It's been 40 years since you guys have won a tournament, yet every time we hear about how England's gonna win. Bit tiresome. At least we Scots know we're gonna get rogered... that's if we even qualify.

That's only because I'm guessing it's not taken seriously in Scotland or Wales and therefore no decent players are produced. I can't believe there is no talent in said countries.

No, it's taken very seriously up here (can't speak for Wales). We're just not very good at producing homegrown talent. Even for a small country our selection sucks. Too many foreign imports favoured over locals doesn't help.

Why? It seems a bit pathetic to me.

Yeah, it is in a way... but if you were Scots you'd see it differently.

Well true, it's just as annoying here but why?

It can't possibly be as annoying for English? If it was you wouldn't ask why Scots and Welsh turn against the team.

Wales and Scotland haven't been at war with England for centuries.

The Scots heads are stuck in the past. We're not a progressive nation by any means. It's about time we grew up. But like I said for me it's sporting rivalry nothing political.

I'm willing to be if Scotland won the world cup or beat England at a football match (for example) it would be mentioned every time they played football ever again.

We'll never know............

I'm glad you asked. While in Australia I noticed so many Australians saying "we love it when we beat the English". Fair enough it's nice to beat another country but it was the "particularly English" part which annoyed me and didn't understand.

Really? Hmm... could be something to do with never forgiving former landlords. That's what we all have in common with England.

It was Brits (not just English) who went over to Australia in the first place.

Ah, where we sent our convicts.

[EvaUnit02]

Because Football is shit.

Why do you hate soccer? The children of suburban middle class families need a sport to play when they are too pussy to partake in the great American pastimes of Baseball, real Football (gridiron) and Basketball.

[BiscLimpkit]

Yup Mark's pretty much summarised almost every Scot's thoughts on the matter.

I won't be supporting England either.

Nothing against the English or the team for that matter - but there's nothing more satisfying than hearing the media whine when their team gets crushed.

[bradavon]

I won't be supporting England either.

Who are you going to support? For the record I agree it's perfectly acceptable to support who you like. I just find it very odd this dislike is "very" much one sided.

but there's nothing more satisfying than hearing the media whine when their team gets crushed.

More so when it's the English?

The English sometimes seem uncomfortable with asserting their Englishness (compared to the Celtic nations) and so maybe that's why they use the Union Jack

Definitely. It's only relatively recent in the last 50 years this has come to be. St. Patrick's Day gets far more press than St. George's.

Why isn't St. George's a bank holiday? Is the Scottish equivalent (I don't even know what that is, which says a lot) a bank holiday?

I'm not really sure why other than an underline regret for past events maybe. The British government handled the whole Ireland situation very badly (i.e - Ireland before Northern Ireland) but on the other hand it's unlikely they'd be what they are today without the English.

In football? Well England isn't Scotland.

I didn't say it was I said it was part of Britain, as you know big difference.

But also because England acts as though it's national team is better than it actually is.

True and it pisses me off as much as it does you but when you have a chance of winning I guess it's easy to get over excited.

No, it's taken very seriously up here (can't speak for Wales). We're just not very good at producing homegrown talent.

I wonder why that is when you consider England is. Sure football orginated in England (I'm fairly sure) but then South American's are very good at football.

Yeah, it is in a way... but if you were Scots you'd see it differently.

If I was the same person as I am now I know I wouldn't. I don't dislike Americans of French like many Brits do, not that I could live in America (nice place to live though).

I know you were joke a bit on this one.

It can't possibly be as annoying for English? If it was you wouldn't ask why Scots and Welsh turn against the team.

Maybe, maybe not. In my case I very much hate football and can't wait for it to be over. Maybe my lack of English pride has to do with being part Irish, possibly I don't know.

Really? Hmm... could be something to do with never forgiving former landlords. That's what we all have in common with England.

I'm sure it is but it's pathetic and like I said even more so in the case of Australia when up until (relatively) recently Australians considered themselves British.

Why do you hate soccer? The children of suburban middle class families need a sport to play when they are too pussy to partake in the great American pastimes of Baseball, real Football (gridiron) and Basketball.

Are this post serious? Who are you going to support?

[thelostdragon]

LOL, @ EVA. Is this a joke again? Soccer is a sport for pussies, but basketball is not? I used to play basketball a lot in Jordan all the guys that were in my grade didn't like to play soccer. When playing basketball, the referee would stop the game each time you would just touch the opponent. How gay is that? In soccer the players tackle and that's ok.

[Markgway]

More so when it's the English?

It's because the English are closest. It's easier to "hate" your neighbour than the rival out of sight. But as I said for me it doesn't go beyond football. Most of the key players in the British government are Scots... you guys should be pissed at us! lol

Definitely. It's only relatively recent in the last 50 years this has come to be. St. Patrick's Day gets far more press than St. George's.

Right. I don't understand that either. I think it's only because Paddy is an excuse for getting pissed.

Is the Scottish equivalent (I don't even know what that is, which says a lot) a bank holiday?

Bloody English! Don't even know our Saint! It's Andrew. Who apparently wasn't even Scots. The patron saint thing is bollocks.

True and it pisses me off as much as it does you but when you have a chance of winning I guess it's easy to get over excited.

I think England are 2nd faves this year so just maybe this year........ NAH!!!

I wonder why that is when you consider England is. Sure football orginated in England (I'm fairly sure) but then South American's are very good at football.

Too many fried Mars bars? Also England IS ten times the size of Jockland. Also England has a lot more black people than Scotland and as you know many of the best English players (and athletes in general) are black.

Maybe my lack of English pride has to do with being part Irish, possibly I don't know.

Treason!!!

Are this post serious?

None of Eva's post the last few days have been serious.

[bradavon]

It's because the English are closest. It's easier to "hate" your neighbour than the rival out of sight.

It would work both ways if that's all it was.

I think it's only because Paddy is an excuse for getting pissed.

Agreed and for the Guinness marketing campaign to go into full swing.

Too many fried Mars bars?

I've heard about those, surely they can't be tasty? Yuck!

Also England IS ten times the size of Jockland.

Jockland is bigger than most people think though, isn't the population 7 million or something similar.

Also England has a lot more black people than Scotland and as you know many of the best English players (and athletes in general) are black.

I wonder why that is maybe because it's something minorities think they have a chance of succeeding in. This is a completely separate discussion.

Interesting I didn't know that so Scotland is mostly white? Only parts of England have a high black population. There are very few in the area I live, shame really.

[Markgway]

I've heard about those, surely they can't be tasty? Yuck!

Never had one. Sounds gross. I love a good fish supper though.

Jockland is bigger than most people think though, isn't the population 7 million or something similar.

I thought it was about 5 million and England 55 million - but that's a guesstimate.

I wonder why that is maybe because it's something minorities think they have a chance of succeeding in. This is a completely separate discussion.

It's a digression, but there's some relevance as to why England produces better atheletes.

Interesting I didn't know that so Scotland is mostly white? Only parts of England have a high black population.

Yeah, you don't see many blacks up here, but you get a lot of Asians. Not sure why it works that way?

There are very few in the area I live, shame really.

Why is it a shame? People are people: black or white. I don't really care what colour someone is for or against.

[BiscLimpkit]

Who are you going to support? For the record I agree it's perfectly acceptable to support who you like. I just find it very odd this dislike is "very" much one sided.

Not sure... I quite like to see the underdogs do well. Hopefully there are a few surprises.

More so when it's the English?

Actually I was only referring to the English, so yeah.

[bradavon]

I figured that

Why is it a shame? People are people: black or white. I don't really care what colour someone is for or against.

Very true but a when you society which is mainly one colour, creed or nationality it is IMO often a racist or at least semi-racist society. A mixture of both/all is the way to go IMO.

[Markgway]

Very true but a when you society which is mainly one colour, creed or nationality it is IMO often a racist or at least semi-racist society. A mixture of both/all is the way to go IMO.

Racist, lol. Britain is probably the least racist country on the planet. I'm sure you'd hate it outside Europe (say China, India) where the vast majority are one race/creed/colour. Or is that OK?

[bradavon]

Britain is probably the least racist country on the planet.

Yeah I know, it was a general point more than an opinion on Britain.

India's incredibly diverse btw.

[Unrealnils]

i expect at one point many years ago it was just england playing the game againts scotland and wales........

[bradavon]

Mark is also right about it being jealousy, which at least I can understand.

[EvaUnit02]

Conflict is a part of human nature. Better it be trivial sports rivalries than an actual [civil] war. 'Nuff said.

[grim_tales]

Greg Rusedski (back to tennis again) is actually Canadian but he plays under the British banner. I dont think anyone over here has any problems supporting him either.
Does it bother you (in Premiership football) if your team doesnt have many English players in it (if you're English that is?) 8)

[grim_tales]

The 1966 syndrome England have pisses me off as well TBH, I think there's too much hype with England, it happens ALL the time, its why we always fail But I'm sure some Scots go on about Archie Gemil's (sp?) goal in 1978
When England lost to Northern Ireland (!) its not something they'll forget in a hurry. OK, NI didnt qualify BUT N.I were still regarded as "British" champions, or something, and they hadn't scored a goal against us (?) for 26 years.