I just had a street fight...

grim_tales · Post by **grim_tales** » 28 Sep 2006, 16:36

The guy we was drunk. OK, what he did was wrong, but as he was drunk maybe the guy wasn't in full command of what he was saying. I can understand why it would be a hurtful comment but not worth beating a guy up over IMO.
Mettarazzi's comment to Zidane about his mum were a disgrace and very hurtful but it was also equally wrong of Zidane to react the way he did and headbutt the guy. Do 2 wrongs make a right? No.

romerojpg · Post by **romerojpg** » 28 Sep 2006, 16:55

Religion once again doing the right thing, insults dont hurt. Fists do.

Bet God was happy about it.

So what is ok, a punch in the face is fine, what is he was shot for saying what he did? is that ok.

Shen · Post by **Shen** » 28 Sep 2006, 17:37

i'd notice you guys avoided a question i asked....

what would you do if someone drunk ashole was harrasing your girlfriend and wouldnt stop, being obscene, offensive and the like, or you had an asian girlfriend and they were making racist comments...what would you do?

islam is LD's life, and no-one likes their belifes, faiths etc to be insulted blah blha its wrong to fight blah blah blah, they guy ended up in hospital, maybe he wount get so smashed that he cant keep control of his mouth next time...

to clear it up i DO NOT usually agree with violence in most circumstances, but there are times were a person just snaps...and i dont blame the person if they are under immense preassure, i have before after being bulied for 10yrs i snapped and laid into the guy, and also when a dude insulted my fater the day after he'd had a major heratattack, i broke his nose...

ciolenceisnt the answer but it sure as hell makes you feel better at times...

gojensen · Post by **gojensen** » 28 Sep 2006, 18:18

Wouldn't stop harassing my GF? Leave. You can (almost) always leave.
Making racist comments? Ignore them. If not. Leave. You can (almost) always leave.

The first thing I learnt as a martial artist was... walk away. If you can avoid the fight, do so.

I think once again we are into this thing called age...

The "russian guy" was a prick, sure I can agree to that. But please remember that as a martial artist you have an obligation to be cool-headed. Your skills will/may be used against you in a court of law. "You should know better." I sure hope LD wasn't returning from some heavy MA training "all hyped up". Then again, from the discussions "recently" on this board I wouldn't really expect him to take this sitting down...

One thing is for certain, being the agressor (as in first to violence) is nothing to be proud of - unless of course it's an MA competition - where first strike often gets you the win (as in real life).

Another thing to think about, what if these 3 "russians" were frequent travellers on that line. What if the "old man" was a frequent traveller on that line? Chances for them to meet up again is huge then, and I'm betting that they would like to exact some revenge on him for what LD did. And it's not certain he can defend himself, as LD maybe could if they ever clashed again. How long is this old man and LD going to keep looking over their shoulders for the russian and his armed mob? (You can be certain they'll be "packing" for a while if they are the kind of scum I surmised they were from LD's original post...)

Shen · Post by **Shen** » 28 Sep 2006, 18:47

you have a fair point, and i agree it is not the right thing to do to make th efirst puch, and as a MA then one is supposed to be discipined, but again i cant say i blame LD for his reaction...and aswell the retaliation thing, but one doesnt think about that at the time.

aswell there isnt alway the option to leave, if your on a train, often they dont have the option to go to the next carriage.

there will always be times when a person will snap, and you cant always blame them, tbh. depends on their cirumstances...

tom2681 · Post by **tom2681** » 28 Sep 2006, 18:52

Gojensen wrote:Leave. You can (almost) always leave.

You sound like a wise old geezer.

Leaving doesn't solve the problem.
These people still exist; they are still insulting people.
If you don't teach them a lesson, then who will ?

At some point you have to step up to the plate and fight for respect.

BiscLimpkit · Post by **BiscLimpkit** » 28 Sep 2006, 18:57

Huge respect to Gojensen. Great post.

tom2681 wrote: Leaving doesn't solve the problem.
These people still exist; they are still insulting people.
If you don't teach them a lesson, then who will ?

Beating them up is not teaching them a lesson. If anything it'll make matters worse - fueling unnecessary rage.

Sorry to hear that you and your faith were insulted LD, but I do think that what you did was wrong.

Yi-Long · Post by **Yi-Long** » 28 Sep 2006, 19:05

The people who say you should just leave, are thinking about the RATIONAL solution. However, in such a situation it's very very hard to stay rational: You're both affraid, and mad as hell... at the same time... like a gun on a hair-trigger....

I had my girl being racially insulted by some maroccan boys, and I wanted to hit the shit outta them, but my girlfriend kept me from doing so...

In times like that, you dont think about the safest option. You just think about payback, about hurting them back, any way you can... you want revenge.

Yeah, might not be smart., but it's human nature.

And the guy being drunk isnt an excuse. Actually it's one more reason why he had it coming. If you cant handle alcohol then just drink it in the privacy of your own home, or make sure your friends will keep you from turning into a drunken moron...

Shingster · Post by **Shingster** » 28 Sep 2006, 19:08

Markgway wrote:If I battered everyone who bothered me I'd be asskicking 24/7. You have to rise above that urge otherwise you're no better than them.

Beating at your door to get at you are they Mark? You wanna invite Romero round for a couple of days to take out the trash 8)

I think once again we are into this thing called age... Rolling Eyes

I agree with what yoiu and Mark are saying Gojenson, but how old is LostDragon? Early 20's? When you're being insulted and the old adrenalin starts pumping it can be very difficult to stop and analyse a situation and think about the consequences. It doesn't excuse LD's actions but it does at least make them understandable and forgivable. His original post didn't sound like he was triumphant bragging either.

I think all of us can think back to a time when we were younger and much more eager to get stuck in when challenged. I was like this as a teenager and earned myself a reputation I wasn't particularly proud of, but as an adult now i'm such a pussy it takes a hell of a lot to rile me to the point of violence (in fact, no one's been able to do so yet

)

tom2681 · Post by **tom2681** » 28 Sep 2006, 19:11

LD's 22, like me.
Gojensen is in his 30's I think.

romerojpg · Post by **romerojpg** » 28 Sep 2006, 19:25

Strangley everyone has a good point, but hey we are not there at that exact moment yes, we can think after the events. I am sure we would all stray from our comments given the right situation.

I was grabbed by some homless guys (and 2 gals too) the other day, by the hand and I couldnt get him to let go, I could have kicked off and hit him, strangley I wasnt afriaid, not bragging as it was daylight and seemed an ok situation, but in hindsight I should have maybe done something more to tell them exactly where to go.

I just kind of laffed it off and went on my way as hell they were pissed out of their heads on massive gallon bottles of cider (which is illegal to drink on the street as far as I know), it was afterwards I thought of what if? what if they had turned violent? what if I had? etc..
and I got pretty angry afterwards and wished I had done more to make my point of KEEP OFF ME! in that situation I think I would have been kind of ok to strike out, just to make him let go, but I just smiled a lot and he got sick in the end.

Yi-Long · Post by **Yi-Long** » 28 Sep 2006, 19:43

romerojpg wrote:
I just kind of laffed it off and went on my way as hell they were pissed out of their heads on massive gallon bottles of cider (which is illegal to drink on the street as far as I know), it was afterwards I thought of what if? what if they had turned violent? what if I had? etc..
and I got pretty angry afterwards and wished I had done more to make my point of KEEP OFF ME! in that situation I think I would have been kind of ok to strike out, just to make him let go, but I just smiled a lot and he got sick in the end.

Sounds like a lovely smile you've got there, Romero

romerojpg · Post by **romerojpg** » 28 Sep 2006, 21:18

Nervous smile I guess

I do that a lot, I may be angry, but best not to show that too much.

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 28 Sep 2006, 23:21

Shen wrote:what would you do if someone drunk ashole was harrasing your girlfriend and wouldnt stop, being obscene, offensive and the like, or you had an asian girlfriend and they were making racist comments...what would you do?

If it was impossible to ignore then I would confront them verbally. I would not, however, resort to violence unless they had similar intention. Why take an argument to the next level where someone can get really hurt? For pride? Pride is expensive if you end up in a hospital... or dead.

islam is LD's life, and no-one likes their belifes, faiths etc to be insulted blah blha its wrong to fight blah blah blah, they guy ended up in hospital, maybe he wount get so smashed that he cant keep control of his mouth next time...

What kind of faith does one have if it needs to be sustained by fists? LD knows his beliefs. Does he (or should he) care what a bunch of Russian drunks think? I have no respect for his religion should he beat me up too?

and also when a dude insulted my fater the day after he'd had a major heratattack, i broke his nose...

Don't fuck with Shen!

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 28 Sep 2006, 23:23

Yi-Long wrote:I had my girl being racially insulted by some maroccan boys, and I wanted to hit the shit outta them, but my girlfriend kept me from doing so...

Aren't you glad she did? What would violence have achieved in the long run?

Gojensen makes some excellent points.

Markgway · Post by **Markgway** » 28 Sep 2006, 23:26

Shingster wrote:Beating at your door to get at you are they Mark? You wanna invite Romero round for a couple of days to take out the trash 8)

Lol, no, but I live in a pretty shitty neighbourhood. I try to keep to myself, but if I spent more time in the streets, well......

I agree with what yoiu and Mark are saying Gojenson, but how old is LostDragon? Early 20's?

I'm no fucking fossil myself. I'll be 27 very soon.

It doesn't excuse LD's actions but it does at least make them understandable and forgivable. His original post didn't sound like he was triumphant bragging either.

Actually, it was this comment of LDs which initially concerned me: "After I took a shower, though, I have to admit that I feel rather good. I don't know why."

Shingster · Post by **Shingster** » 29 Sep 2006, 00:11

Actually, it was this comment of LDs which initially concerned me: "After I took a shower, though, I have to admit that I feel rather good. I don't know why."

Glory rush, he was in a scary situation, lashed out and didn't recieve a beating in return, as shameless as it might sound it's only human that part of him would be glad. Notice that he says "for some reason" though, he wasn't jumping out the shower thinking "wahey i kicked some fucking ass"

thelostdragon · Post by **thelostdragon** » 29 Sep 2006, 00:38

Everybody has made very good points there. I have to agree the most with romero on one aspect, though. Very often have I walked away in such situations. Later, I felt worse than I did on Tuesday, after I had that fight. One time I was standing at the station waiting for the subway. I saw three grown men talking to 4 kids at the age of probably 12 or 13. Three girls and one boy. Two of the adults stood threateningly around them, avoiding them to escape and the other man who did the talking told the boy to go home. I saw that all the kids were really afraid. These 3 assholes must have felt really strong. I entered the train and the young boy, did too. The girls outside, standing at the station with these men, looked through the window at the boy. I still remember their glances. Their face simply expressed, "Help!".

I asked the boy what was going on. He told me that these men followed them through the city and kept checking out these 12-years-old girls. When they stood at the station, they made the boy leave. I got so angry. These girls felt like shit and the boy, too. What a disgrace this must have been for him, leaving the girls with these scumbags as he was too afraid of them himself. I told him not to worry and got off at the next station, running back. When I arrived at the station, they were gone. The only thing I could do was call the cops. Told them about all, but hell... I don't know what happened later on and will probably never know either.

And still today I reproach myself for not acting or interfering when I saw these 3 assholes talking rather roughly to these kids. I was just too ignorant or maybe not courageous enough to stand up to these assholes or to ask them what they were doing with these kids. I wish I did. Then I wouldn't have to be ashamed of myself these days. I've told friends about this and they said that it wasn't my fault and all the usual comforting shit you usually get from friends. But hell, when I think of the last thing I have seen from these girls, which was that "Help me!"-face, I could throw up at what a pussy I have been back then.

God knows what they did to these girls or if the cops got them.

Shingster · Post by **Shingster** » 29 Sep 2006, 01:39

Everyone's been in that sort of situation LD, hell if I had a nickel for everytime I wish i'd said something to a group of guys acting aggressively towards someone else, by now it'd make up a lot for the guilt I felt afterwards.

thelostdragon · Post by **thelostdragon** » 29 Sep 2006, 01:42

Shingster wrote:Everyone's been in that sort of situation LD

Yeah, but I can't live with it that easily.

the68monkey · Post by **the68monkey** » 29 Sep 2006, 01:44

Last week my 7-year-old told me that a dear playmate of hers asked her if she believed in god. When my daughter replied that she wasn't sure, the friend then asked if we go to church. My daughter told her that no, we don't go to church. The friend went and told her mom, then later reported back to my daughter that she couldn't come over to our house to play anymore.

I think I'll go kick some 7-year-old butt and show that kid not to insult anybody's personal/religious beliefs.

But seriously, this did happen last week. My kid is really upset about it, so I had to explain to her that she could still play with the friend at school, but if her friend's family was so narrow-minded that they couldn't see what a good and caring friend my daughter is, it would be their loss in the end. Talk about religous intolerance. . . .

Shingster · Post by **Shingster** » 29 Sep 2006, 01:56

Tell your kid to tell her friend that if she doesn't let her play round her house, her scary german uncle LostDragon is gonna hop on a plane and come kick her ass!

EDIT: Then if you really wanna scare the bible bashing mum, tell her he's A MUSLIM

the68monkey · Post by **the68monkey** » 29 Sep 2006, 02:04

thelostdragon · Post by **thelostdragon** » 29 Sep 2006, 02:14

Shingster wrote:Then if you really wanna scare the bible bashing mum, tell her he's A MUSLIM

A child-eating saracen. :twisted:

Seriously, though, WTF? Talk about being an extremist. If they raise her kid like that, then she won't have exactly many friends around her, that's for sure. Who goes to church these days? In Germany, the only people you see at church are either veeeeery young or veeeeery old.

By the way, not meaning to start a flame war, but isn't that off-topic, or inappropriate in this thread?

the68monkey · Post by **the68monkey** » 29 Sep 2006, 02:23

Not meant to be off-topic. Sorry. Just another example of religious intolerance. I'll shut up now.

P.S. Tickets to America are in the mail, LD.